Thursday, October 20, 2011

Sense of Belonging Among Psychopaths.

"I have a question about self-awareness: you can easily spot fellow psychopaths, but for a long time you didn't know you were a psychopath. Before you became self-aware, did you sense that you were part of a minority,
and that other people whom you know know are psychopaths had something in common with you?"
My immediate reply to this question from a Reader was: Yes... and No! A little more explanation is in order:

I can see in hindsight why I sometimes felt "I'm like you!" about someone else who was also a psychopath, and though I never could confirm it, I just knew. Often I could tell that the other guy knew as well. Especially when I was younger I hoped to find out what it was that made me and those few other individuals different from everybody else, but I had no word for it. Now I have words for it, and they confirm what I felt back then and still feel when I meet another psychopath.

Since psychopaths rarely are attracted to each other and feel no reason to interact unless we have a common goal and can benefit from cooperating, it would mostly happen in that I knew exactly what the other person's motives were and could foresee his next moves. It's an unspoken recognition that "I understand this guy", whereas with normal people I may be able to foretell their behavior and motives, but I will never really, truly understand them.

Even when I meet others like me and I have a sense of recognition, I still feel set apart even from them. There is no sense of 'belonging' among psychopaths in the way that I imagine you have in mind. So whereas I did have some kind of vague awareness when I met another psychopath, also from early on in life, my sense of uniqueness has always been the strongest. When I meet other people and recognize they're psychopaths, it is just that: A recognition.

I can mention one thing that I noticed. When I met a psychopathic individual, and if circumstances spoke for it, we would use it to undertake actions in a quick and effective manner... actions which - when I undertook them with non-psychopaths - always require discussion and debating and lining up and agreeing on all the details in advance so as to not misunderstand the behavior or the intentions of someone else. With another psychopath things often happen almost without any talk at all, except for the most fundamental details that can't be 'intuitively' understood (locations' names, f.x.).

Today I am fully aware when I spot someone else, and I can tell if they're aware as well.

15 comments:

Psychopath said...

Exactly.

Anonymous said...

What do you think when professionals say 'psychopaths can't get along with each other'? Is it an exaggeration? Or is there something the professionals can't quite understand?"

Psychopath said...

Personally speaking, I have no desire, or need to befriend another psychopath. Magnets, identical poles will repel ;)

Anonymous said...

:-) this is something I have wondered about for a long time. For the simple reason that I believe many psychopaths will try to manipulate without properly sussing out the people in question. The result is that in my experience, they try to manipulate other psychopaths! This never works, and causes resentment, and anger on the part of the other one (how dare they?!). Personally, I have a friend who is also a psychopath, and I believe to a much greater extent than me. She can manipulate everyone we both know, with the result that everyone seems to worship her. She knows that I do not, and I think she knows that due to the fact that she used to try to manipulate me, I despise her. I tolerate her as this is in my best interest. On her part I think she hates me in return...possibly because I am immune to her control?! I don't know.

This is how psychopaths get on. We don't! Like knows like, and like trys to manipulate like sometimes. It doesn't work. I also know another 'shallow effect' who I get along with relatively well- but she is not manipulative.

I have also come across this in the workplace, where I had a boss who was an exceptionally extreme psychopath- a textbook case- who bullied us interns and sucked up to superiours. Again, he had not done his research, and instead tried to control a 'group' instead of a weak individual. He tried to bully me as I was an intern and he thought I would never tell. I got revenge.

Has anyone else had this experience? What about revenge, do you think this is more prevalent amongst psychopaths than normals? I for one, have no qualms about it!!

Anonymous said...

Those descriptions of persons in your life don't sound like psychopaths... just assholes.

lele said...

@Anonymous October 28, 2011 10:59 PM

I wonder whether psychopaths *must* have a revenge *at all costs*, or if they can just pass by whenever they feel they have better goals to accomplish at the moment (going after a revenge may be time and resource-consuming). Perhaps they just take a mental note about that person and wait for a better chance to strike, even after decades?

Psychopath said...

@lele

I can only speak for myself. But I never forget when someone went out of their way to mess with me. I make a mental note, and if the time is right, opportunity etc. I may act on a little pay back. Nothing that would get me in trouble of course. But since the person decided to play the game with me... well, I must return the favour. After all, I know I play the game better, and wouldn't want that person to feel left out of the game they started :) Or perhaps that is the Narc side speaking.

Decades ? yes.

Robin D. said...

Anonymous 10:59

"I believe many psychopaths will try to manipulate without properly sussing out the people in question. The result is that in my experience, they try to manipulate other psychopaths! This never works, and causes resentment, and anger on the part of the other one (how dare they?!)."

Psychopaths have different levels of intelligence. Those who are highly intelligent usually know when they meet another psychopath.

But it can happen anyway, because many psychopaths have an incredibly high level of paranoia. That's why they're described as reacting to real AND perceived sleights.

When a highly intelligent psychopath reacts this way to another psychopath, even if the other psychopath hasn't attacked or ridiculed them, it is usually because that psychopath has a comorbid mental illness, often paranoid phychosis.

It makes that highly intelligent psychopath weaker than other highly intelligent psychopaths, and maybe that's why they often hate the stronger psychopaths really deeply and will do almost anything to discredit and ridicule them.

But of course they know that they can't hurt another psychopath.

But they attack other psychopaths because by convincing all the ASPD and socios that this psychopath is weak and that they won over him, the ASPD and socios will admire himself instead and follow him. Because the ASPD and socios don't know that they can't hurt the other psychopath, they don't even know if he IS a psychopath. Only other psychopaths, IF they're highly intelligent, can see who is a psychopath.
Even the best psychologists never become as good at it as psychopaths themselves.

For an intelligent psychopath it's easy to make a large number of people who are socio or ASPD believe in a competely fiction reality by using a mixture of fact and false claims and repeating them and saying they actually KNOW things that are just speculations that could mean anything.

I have seen exactly this happening only a few months ago. Zhawq knows it and says that method works everytime, and he's LAUGHING even though it was him it was done to!

Anonymous said...

Let us hope this 'Intelligent psychopath' has at least a basic understanding of the correct use of a grammar...

Anonymous said...

As a young psychopath (primary), I'm disappointed. Either I don't share this ability to spot other psychos, or I am simply not around them frequently. It's also possible that I've misidentified people - they're different from others, special somehow; I don't want to interact with them, but I have an immense respect for them. I've never considered these people psychopathic, though.

Moreover I am disappointed by the sense of belonging. It is a sensation I actively seek, but have never felt. I had hoped that having sought a fellow psychopath would bring me comfort - a chance to let down the mask, discuss, deliberate, and scheme together. I had hoped that the chance of nigh-instantaneous interactions would allow a more thrilling experience to which I may look forward. These interactions would never be prolonged, of course. Obsessions like this rarely last more than three weeks, and more typically last only 11 days. Still I am haunted by this truth. Is there perhaps a flaw in my reasoning, either in hopes or in let-down? Do you truly not get along with fellow psychopaths, even on the internet?

I prefer this answered by Zhawq, but any other believably psychopathic individual is welcome. Comments which betray complete stupidity will be ignored, of course :)

Obliged
-Gene Gray

Anonymous said...

Holy fuck! You have just provided me with an explanation for a lot of unexplained vague theories and ideas I keep toying around with in my mind.

Anonymous said...

I am a Sociopath, beyond any textbook's definitiion, non-violent, no criminal history whatsoever. Years ago I grew tired of "normal" people, too easy, boring. I can identify another Sociopath/Psychopath instantly. Usually by making eye contact with them.

I actively seek out and engage others simular to myself hoping they will provide the challenge that I crave. A constant stream of adversaries is necessary for constant stimulation and to provide the opportunity to continually hone my skills.

My goal is to give them the mind-fuck of their lives, to confuse them mentally and emotionally, make them hate me so badly they will seek revenge at all costs. Then I suddenly go quiet, "evaporate" from their lives, remove their perceived ability to manipulate and control, and watch from a distance as they implode.

Inflicting great emotional pain and trauma on those who "cannot feel" is challenging and once accomplished personally rewarding. It satisfies me knowing that I have caused so many in my peer group to self destruct. Arrogant and cruel statements if read by one who is diagnosed as "normal" I know. But when read by fellow Sociopaths and Psycopaths it is fully understood and likely seen as a challenge.

I am crazy, not stupid. We do recover quickly so the implosions and the self destruction are only temporary. The hate and desire for revenge however will remain for a lifetime in the minds of those who I have "wronged".

But you know what? I don't give a shit, I'm a Sociopath ;-)

Brian Letscher said...

My mother was manically depressed bi-polar and schizophrenic so I didn't have much a chance of being born not a psychopath but many people born this way learn through social norms how to act and integrate themselves into society. Only a few born this way raised in a specific environment exhibit the traits you all seem to be looking for. You would meet me a well built good looking 22 year old infantry soldier and think I'm exceedingly polite, a stand up guy you want to date your daughter. I've never been arrested never received a ticket but i know I'm dangerous. I run though endless scenarios during day to day action on how to most effectively kill all those around me if, of course I had need to. The only point I'm trying to make here is I was made when I was 7 because my mom during a custody battle realized the easiest way for her to get full custody is to have me fake rape charges against my dad. So as an infant child I stood under oath and lied to a courtroom about my entire fictitious ordeal. Of course it worked I was an amazing liar at that age and I had to live with my abusive unstable mom till 4 years later she died from a heroin OD. From that court date she got me but when I got was an unrelenting hatred of all those that sent me to live with her and couldn't see I was being forced to say these things. Now because of that I walk this earth with a hatred of 99% of people out there that frankly I just don't believe cut it. Your to dumb you don't really see what your looking at and your a self centered monster. That's why I strive torwards the military the one place I believed there was any honer and trust among men. And I found it. the men that serve under me when shit hits the fan they are all I care about and would take a bullet for any of them. Not in 99% view of the phrase either when your saying something to express amount of care you have for someone. No I would literally step in front of a bullet for any of my men. So that's what confuses me because I do care about things more than myself and according to all these articals that means im good right?totally normal becuse I care for a few other people? I can't take pictures of myself I have 2877 photos on my phone and I know not one of those has me in it. Explain that maybe just low self esteem right? I'm insainly confident and have never wanted a girl i haven't had. The girl I've been obsessed with for the past 4 years is also a psychopath as well as a strait A honor student in field of psychology she's going to be a therapist haha. and we talk almost every night but the highlights of our talks is when we have sex with other people we tell each other because we know it hurts and love that. I've manipulated girls into crazy embarising situations for very little sexual pleasure but what really got me going was how much this would hurt when I told my friend about it. We couldn't date because it's like locking to 2 starved animals in a cage with society (prey) we can only meet up about twice a month to hook up and go on our manipulation adventures that would leave most of you feeling sick. I dont know exactly what I am but I do know I'm not making anything up or trying to sound cool I want you all to see that you have literally no idea what your dealing with so stop trying to fucking categorize us when it appears that your all to scared to even interview a psychopath....

ada said...

I am undiagnosed and it will stay that way unless I want an official diagnosis. I like having no records, no history. My medical past and former diagnoses are all dated and incorrect anyways, which makes it that much easier for me in the future to twist things any way I want.

Female. 21. Narcissistic Persobality disorder, AsPD, manipulative and intelligent as duck. I like to think I could spot one of us and I think I have several times, but certain circumstances kept me from interacting the way I wanted with them (obvious separate agendas, mismatch in portrayed belief systems, etc.).

I'm very proud of what I am and want to tell everyone, honestly, because what we are has a sort of sexy appeal to it right now in pop culture, and it would make things easier when luring prey. But at the same time, no one can know because it will, in the long run, make things very very difficult.

If they know they are wary.

But I get bored so easily. I find myself constantly getting into new social situations with new people just in the hopes I'll meet someone like myself, who presents a genuine challenge, who can relate and scheme and share stories and lie as well as I do.

For a long time I thought there was something wrong with me, that I was a malfunctioning empath who didn't know who she was or what she felt.

I cut myself, I tried to kill myself, I thought I was a monster for hurting people and not really caring.

Now I've come to understand and embrace myself. There's nothing wrong with the masks, there's nothing wrong with me. Some people are predators, some are prey.

Richy said...

I'm not a psychopath, but I'm not a neurotypical either and can I can spot a psychopath. I think it's funny when they start mirroring people and I can spot their games and start playing along. When they found out, they get pissed and want to take their revenge on me.