Wednesday, March 9, 2011

The Psychopath Gender. (Part II)

Anyway, I soon realized I felt no more for these women than I had ever felt for any other person, gay or straight.
It was very perplexing.

The next idea I got in this respect was this: Maybe I was really a man trapped in a woman's body, and I should really go trans-gender and find my happiness - or at least a lot more opportunities - that way. I eventually gave up the idea, for I couldn't really picture myself as the stud I'd want to be if I should go male.

So I've eventually stuck with me female image, and am working on perfecting that as best as I can. And whoa, are there possibilities there, brothar! Ha!


Since I came to terms with just being someone with a female body but with a mind that seemed to be as much female as male, I've gone through some other searches pertaining to what I really am - since I am so obviously not like anyone else I've ever met.

And it was then that I recently - via another looking into Autism and learning about Asperger's, which again led me to the uncanny meeting with a mirror reflection that has been both exhilarating and slightly unnerving - that I was reminded of the diagnosis I got when I was in jail for murder back at my 18th year: Psychopath.

Like others I've read about - also here in your blog - I never took that diagnosis seriously... But on meeting with so many sources of information about what psychopathy really is - not least Robert D. Hare's books 'Without Conscience' and 'Snakes in Suits', which he's the co-author on (I can lend you both books if you haven't read them), but also via the various blogs that have begun to appear, written by mainly Sociopaths (but still, Sociopathy and Psychopathy are related, so I've learned a lot by reading about both), there're so much that has become clear to me, and which before used to be a great mystery...

One of those things is our tendency to not have an inherent sense of gender!

It's still something I wonder about ... I mean, there's no doubt that I really do not identify with the female gender any more than I identify with the male gender - even though I look the female part and play especially on it's strong sides whereas I leave the male counterparts out because it just wouldn't have the same effect coming from a woman.

But in the books I have read so far on Psychopathy there isn't much about us having no gender identity.

Also, it's not that many autobiographic descriptions that I've read so far, so it could be either some coincidence, or it could be that we're a sub group and maybe in fact different from Psychopaths or Sociopatahs.
I've wondered about the same thing when it comes to the many correlating traits in people with Asperger's and people who are Sociopaths or Psychopaths. - I really do wonder. And that's why I wrote you, hoping you might have some answers to this.
And if you don't, I feel you may be the one who will find out where we are with this, as you seem to be the more serious in that you don't hop over where the fence is lowest, as I see some of the most 'popular' bloggers do (not that I blame them, haha! I mean, who wouldn't do what they do if you can get popular by it? And after all, that's most likely where you're headed too. Eh?).


What's your gender, Zhawq?... :D

I hope you'll feature the video I mentioned. I've send you a link to it, and I really think it's cool!


Yep, I published the video you suggested. Think it's cool too. ;)

12 comments:

TheNotablePath said...

Ah! I wish this was part of the first blog entry :P I was wondering how it had to do with gender identity, much...

Attraction is a funny thing. I haven't had sex with a guy, but I find good looking men and women just about as arousing, however, most guys who set off my gay-dar are somewhat effeminate, and with guys I'm more into manly men, the same way with women I'm not into tom boys. I'd have to go looking for the right guy for my tastes, basically. Not difficult, but I prefer not to pick up people at bars or clubs.

I think my lack of sold gender identity gets me in trouble, too. Often my misanthropy is mistaken for misogyny to hilarious but infuriating results.

Good second post, reader. I probably wouldn't have been so abrasive if it was in one batch instead of two, especially at yesterday's cut off point.

Zhawq said...

Yeah, well I did think about the problem with cutting the text in two parts, but it was too long as it was (for my taste), that's why I left a '(Part I)', just in case.

What you say about wanting men to be 'manly' in order for you to get aroused, ...I'd say I'm probably the opposite. I don't get aroused easily anyway, but if I'm already in the mood and there were only men around, I'd definitely pick the smallish feminine guy.

I can't perform well if a man is dominating me, lol. I don't think I'd perform well under domination, period. That is, I might perform, but not well. *s*

TheNotablePath said...

That's probably a symptom not having sex with one. I'm not thinking in terms of, who is going to be the Dom, I'm thinking, oh, that person is pretty to look at :P Hope that makes sense...

By the way, this isn't a scientific article, just an SW daily post, but it does touch on this subject, with a decent comment section.

Link

Zhawq said...

Notable,

Yeah I get it. So it just may be that we have the same 'taste' in men, lol.

I'll take a look at that post (think I read it once actually... looking again).

Zhawq said...

Notable,

I have now re-read the article you link to. And I'm glad I did.

M.E. writes:
"Many have commented since that sociopaths seem to have no particular sexual identity..."

M.E. is so nice with creating links to his sources, but in this case I'd really have liked for him top link to some of those 'many' who have commented thus.

See, what threw me off at first was the fact that even though this seems to me a very obvious fact - and I can as I write this think of a few clearly psychopathic individuals about whom I know for absolutely certain they share this trait with me! And for those of them who are highly intelligent (and at least two of those I have in mind are), I'm just as sure that they know it too - about themselves, and obviously about me since I never made a secret of the fact.

Blake is a good example.

(yeah, I thought I'd repay you your many favors of telling others how I think and feel and so on, Blake! lol.)

He may not come off as very intelligent, but that's another game he plays. His IQ is a good deal higher than mine (which is not in the genius range, but a decent 148). ;)

But I digress.

What threw me off was the fact that I have seen/read NO mentioning of this by ANY of the high profile leading researchers and experts who have produced books/texts/reports/i.e. about psychopathy in the last 2-3 decades.

I can't help but wonder why that is?
Or maybe I've just happened to not read exactly those books or texts.

Robert Hare, f.ex., who is the leading expert and who's definition on psychopathy and related conditions is the most widely used/followed by the institutions where it really matters (the Law system, courts, prisons, psychiatric facilities and hospitals, universities and other educational institutions, i.e.), in his most famous work 'Without Conscience' touches on the psychopath subgroup who's main trait is hypo-vigilance/hyper-sexuality, but nowhere does he as much as hint on psychopaths generally having no specific sexual identity or preference (which latter may also be something of a postulate since most have SOME activities that are more arousing than others. But it's tentative at best).

This was what threw me off.

.....

Zhawq said...

...This was what threw me off, but there's more.

Have you noticed the overly masculine self portrayal we see in the SW 'path' community?

Even the women take on a very masculine and aggressive approach (which I'm sure they don't always have elsewhere, even if they may not be the prototype of femininity), and some women avoid letting us know they are women altogether (even when asked directly).

I believe this is simply a pragmatic precaution people take because in this community ANY weakness, real or perceived, can place you in a less advantageous position.

(And who doesn't like at least SOME recognition?! We'd be fools and too obviously lying if we claimed to not care at all....and yeah, there're quite a few fools of this type around, lol). But there's a difference between 'liking' recognition if it happens to come your way, and to go to any extreme JUST in order to obtain such recognition. The latter is the Narcissist approach.)

A few of the males seem genuinely to be understanding themselves as they portray themselves. For obvious reasons these are mainly Sociopaths, and some of them are AsPD'ers.

As I see it, the reason for this being such an issue has something to do with the massive presence of posing machos, but even more so it has to do with the well known fact that we tend to have large egos - mainstream experts in contempt calls it our grandiosity. That's of course another way of saying:

'When someone we haven't (yet?) deemed psychopathic has a strong personality and is doing what WE like and find morally good, they have a strong personality, whereas when a psychopath has a strong personality, s/he is grandiose and faking so as to cover up they're truly shallow and empty!'

That aside, strong and big personalities will create strong and big waves and thunder.

If you, Notable - If anybody who reads this - come upon any articles or texts that in any way pertains to the topic of the tendency among us (Psychopaths/Sociopaths/AsPD'ers) to not have a defined sexual identity, I'd appreciate if you'll bother leave a link or URL - or send me an email if you prefer that; either possibility is fine with me.

Thank you in advance!...

Blammer said...

I think these girls in this video fucking rock. I think they're incredibly in touch with their sexual power. I can get this way. It's exhilarating. It's amazing to feel connected to myself physically. I love to be with a man feeling like this, and I don't mean in bed. Can't stand to be around men or women who want to keep this side of me hidden. In fact I want to kick their ass if they try.

Zhawq said...

Blammer,

These are good words you say, yes, I really like it! And I agree about those girls, it was actually the visual side of this video more than anything that made me decide to put it on.

.....

I have a question and it's about something I've heard before:

Being in touch with one's body.

What does that mean? I'm not saying I feel out of touch with my body, in fact I think being IN touch is the natural state of affairs for me, and it always was. Even as a youngster when I felt the pressure Blammer mentions.

Maybe it's more like....It never really occurred to me that someone can be 'out of touch with their body'. But I hear it often, so there must be something there I don't quite understand.

If someone can answer that question, please do.

ZKM said...

I'm fascinated by the amount of attention this has gotten, simply because I haven't thought about it much. I noticed immediately and have thought it common knowledge Sociopaths' lack of gender identity.

However, looking back I can see some definite dichotomy in some of the observations I have made of people in the community. It seems in general, the calm and centered sociopath admits to being either asexual or polyamorous. The more aggressive sociopaths tend to claim a preference toward sexual dominance and a bit of sadism.

What *I* think is a lot of this difference stems for how they view the community. Some people research and talk on these various blogs as a means to quench curiosity or simply analyze like minded individuals. Some people see it as another pissing match, much like their regular lives. They keep up the same mask they use to intimidate moronic normals.

Personally, I don't see gender as being anything more than a biological difference. Much like the idea of morality, it is a social construct. What that means for me is the necessity to choose which side of the fence puts my talents to light to the best advantage.

I am a female who does not generally disclose that information in these types of conversations because I don't see the point. It's completely unimportant. Sexuality wise, I could go either way. I chose to portray myself in my real life as a homosexual for various reasons.

I think what makes it impossible to delineate between how Sociopath's view gender is our habit of being perpetually dishonest and chameleon-like. Were I a missionary I'd be the image of demure femininity and were I in prison I would be as masculine as any testosterone stuffed man.

Any research you found would be skewed by the fact that the most oft interviewed psychopaths are criminals, and since society generally associates femininity with weakness, the intelligent male psychopath would naturally choose to portray a manly if not completely chauvinistic personality. The only honest psychopath is an anonymous psychopath-but even then, I've been known to lie just as much with or without my identity being disclosed.

Blammer said...

Being in touch with your body allows you to "go with your gut," so to speak. Listening to internal cues to know what FEELS right, wrong or indifferent.

Muscles have memory just like the brain. Think back to an experience you had that was memorable. Where do you have tension in your body while thinking about it. Is this tension pleasurable or not? Get to know your body.

I believe "shakra" awareness helps.
I don't know about these things, but I know there are people in this community who know it and use it to their advantage.

Zhawq said...

Blammer:

"Being in touch with your body allows you to "go with your gut," so to speak. Listening to internal cues to know what FEELS right, wrong or indifferent."

You mean like paying attention to how your experiences affect you emotionally and thus also physically (since the two are connected and in a sense the same thing)?

If so, I just can't imagine what it must be like to not pay attention to your own reactions to what you see, hear, experience per se.


"Muscles have memory just like the brain."

This is a misunderstanding. It is the brain that contains memory pertaining to the muscles and sending the signals to the muscles so that it seems as if it is them that has the memory.

But even if it's a false belief, it works in practice, and I can understand why you have bought the idea.


"Think back to an experience you had that was memorable. Where do you have tension in your body while thinking about it."

That is the brain sending it's signals generated by the memory.


"Is this tension pleasurable or not? Get to know your body."

This is what I mean: I've always known my body this way.

I remember trying out yoga a couple of times when I was with someone who was much into that kind of thing, and there were so many of the coursists who said they were working on getting in touch with their bodies and stuff. I've even helped out some of my spouses with this kind of thing. I guess it's simply just natural to me.


"I believe "shakra" awareness helps."

'Shakra', as in 'Chakra'? Those points along your spine that is also a part of yoga?


"I don't know about these things, but I know there are people in this community who know it and use it to their advantage."

I see. Do you plan to try it out? And if you do, what specific path do you think of taking on first? If we're talking about yoga there're many kinds, some are mere meditation, whereas others are various kinds of physical exercises in combination with meditation.

Thank you for explaining.

Blammer said...

"If so, I just can't imagine what it must be like to not pay attention to your own reactions to what you see, hear, experience per se."

It is a blindspot. It is a joke on yourself.

No. I don't usually mix physical exercise with cerebral stuff. I am like you; things like this are natural for me. But I do use it to release mental tension.


Yoga is great. But I don't meditate. Maybe I will try.

Look up Feldenkrais. (sp)

I mentioned "muscle memory"
because if you manipulate your body FIRST, you might be able to unlock something which has been bottled up for a long time, something you didn't remember consciously.