Wednesday, February 16, 2011

Reality - What we see.

A reader wrote:

"Empath people tend to live a lot on what they believe and expect. Maybe some of us are doing the same thing?"


The truth about this is that all human beings live our lives as much as possible in accordance to what we believe, have been taught, our own conclusions, etc., and thus also in accordance to the expectations that follow thereof. And this is no different for Psychopaths.

Yes, I know I'm saying I am not a Psychopath, but I am human and so are Psychopaths, and that means what I say above applies to Psychopaths as does it to every single individual (with perhaps the exception of the most rare of all: The ultimately enlightened deeply initiated Occultist/Religious Person).

I've noticed that many of those who consider themselves psychopaths, Sociopaths and Antisocial - and who very often likely are Antisocial or at least Sociopaths - have a tendency to believe that our lesser emotionality (this being a trait, like so many others, that I share with Psychopaths) which enables us to keep a sharper focus and see more details as well as get a more efficient view over the whole picture, ...that this means we can 'see' and 'understand' reality clearly and completely, as it 'really' is.

To me it is fairly obvious that those who do in reality take this position are no less deluded than the general public, and I know some will likely disagree and perhaps take a less positive stand towards this statement of mine.


I will explain what I see from a wider perspective, including what I think is really the case here:

Many Psychopaths sometimes give statements of a nature such as this:

"The Victim is ruled by emotions, emotions cloud their vision and ability to achieve a clear perception, whereas we/I can view the situation unvarnished by emotional clutter, and I therefore see things as they really are, the weaknesses in the victim are therefore apparent and I easily make the conclusions about how things Really are!"

My claim is that the intelligent Psychopath have no illusions of being able to see anything 'clearly', of seeing things as 'they really are'. What 'we' are instead doing - what we're really doing when we say such things - is giving - or trying to be giving - the impression that we have knowledge about everything; we use our very knowledge that the human psyche act and reacts - physically and psychologically - in accordance to what they believe and expect.

If you believe that I know a lot and that I know much more than you do, you'll be more likely to believe whatever I say is the truth at a later point - that point, when I've worked an individual into a certain spot where I want them to be ... that special spot where they're emotionally and mentally weakened, vulnerably open and therefore susceptible to a statement put forth by me in a dominant and confident matter-of-fact like manner. It is the situation I could call 'A Soil well prepared and ready for the Seeds of my choosing to be sown' ... then I can give any statement and call it The Truth, and the victim will believe me, even if I do not.

And to be matter-of-fact like: I do not believe my statements in these situations. It does not matter if they're true or not, what matters is their impact upon the individual (or 'victim', if you prefer the more dramatic verb) I am saying these things to.

This is what intelligent Psychopaths are doing, I'm absolutely certain of it. And it works because we're good at giving the impression of having 'second sight'-like abilities.

10 comments:

TheNotablePath said...

Confidence is Never Wrong.

That about sums it up. You'd have to be viewed as weak or foolish not to pull it off, or so drastically polar opposite of that person's view on something.

On seeing clearly. Almost all people are clever and cunning. It's in our blood, as a natural hybrid omnivore. Even complete dolts can figure things out. I don't think intelligence has much to do with seeing clearly. I think what it is would have to be Focus.

As someone of the spectrum, I can attest I have intense focus. Tunnel vision, if anything, but with eagle eye lenses. It doesn't make me capable of seeing something others don't through observation, but it means that I will see it more often, because that is what I'm looking for, as an intra-species predator.

Anyone can find these "gems" that psychopaths claim to see that no one else can. The issue being that we are looking for them from Day 1, where most stop in early childhood as empathy and strong emotions take hold. We never stop being vigilant, so it's fair to say that your average Joe could catch up, but probably wouldn't have much of a chance until his/her hormones calmed the eff down.

MrBlake said...

Zhawq
Haha. There you go again nit picking about not being a psychopath or maybe being one.

Don't get me wrong, I know why you do it, and sure only others on the spectrum can really spot you.

Just can't help it. You're so funny when you do it. Lol.

And you know I like you, pal! ;)


NotablePath
"Confidence is Never Wrong."

Honey bunny dear, all I can say is that I've proved confidence in people wrong probably hundreds of times.

Confidence in people who have nothing to back it up with is worthless.

As for wrong or right I don't care shit 'bout that. It's what works that matters, pure and simple. Lol.

Ps. 'Bout the honey bunny stuff - just kiddin'. I think you're a proud and intelligent woman, so don't get me wrong, I'm just in one of those kinda moods. :)

TheNotablePath said...

If you proved it wrong, then the confidence clearly was not strong enough ;)

But now you're the one nit-piking my message, but that's the price I pay for not clarifying.

If someone exudes confidence, and being sure beyond a shadow of a doubt, only the most cautious or learned minds will question, while the rest bob their heads and agree.

Zhawq said...

Notable:

" You'd have to be viewed as weak or foolish not to pull it off, or so drastically polar opposite of that person's view on something."

Not even so. You can turn someone completely around they'll take a stand that is destructive towards themselves. That's the very point.


"Almost all people are clever and cunning."

I guess we see things very differently in this matter.


"I don't think intelligence has much to do with seeing clearly. I think what it is would have to be Focus."

Again, I have to disagree. Clearly focus is needed, but so is intelligence. A retarded individual doesn't see anything clearly. Yeah, maybe food on the plate when they're hungry, but ask them to tell you what they deciphered from this morning's news feed and they can focus as much as they like, they won't be able to.


"It doesn't make me capable of seeing something others don't through observation"

In that case it's not what you say it is. If it was, you'd see something others don't ... through observation.


"Anyone can find these "gems" that psychopaths claim to see that no one else can."

No, anyone cannot. If they could, they would. There's a reason why so many come and say they wish they could see what and how 'we' see.


"The issue being that we are looking for them from Day 1"

We are looking for them from day 1 because that's how we're 'wired', it's what we were made to do, so to speak. Everybody will tend to follow their inherent 'talent', but only the strongest pull it off and live by it, most become 'redirected' through their upbringing and the pressure from their surroundings.


MrBlake:

"Haha. There you go again nit picking about not being a psychopath or maybe being one."

So I do. I'm a fine, empathic individual if you don't realize. Haven't you noticed my tendency to shed a tear whenever someone mentions a love story or their neighbor had a baby?

Oh, nobody mentioned any of those things, that's right. Maybe that's why I come off as such a cold hearted bastard. Man, it's not fair, I'm SO misunderstood! Hehe


"Don't get me wrong, I know why you do it, and sure only others on the spectrum can really spot you."

Uhm... I somehow think there may be quite a few around these parts who think I'm a psychopath or a sociopath or whatever even if they're not.
It's just a feeling I have. But maybe I'm paranoid, lol.


"And you know I like you, pal! ;)"

I like you too, Blake.

TheNotablePath said...


"Almost all people are clever and cunning."

I guess we see things very differently in this matter.


Agreed, that we see things differently. Maybe we categorize cunning and cleverness differently. I suspect that is it.

Cunning: Having or showing skill in achieving one's ends by deceit or evasion

Even a simple-minded child has cunning.

Clever: To be sly, cunning, mentally sharp or talented.

Most people can be sly, sans retardation (which by the way, was a pretty terrible arguement against me for you making a point) and talented in some manner.

So now that you know how I view the words in this context, do you still disagree? I'm not talking about being brilliant or a savant. I'm talking about natural human tendencies and talents, much like most animals have to some degree. It's not learned, it's instinctual.


In regards to focus, how are you defining intelligence here? Because I'm talking about having a higher cognitive ability than average, and you're speaking about retards. Again, I think you're deciphering my words incorrectly. Not all psychopaths are intelligent, in the same way not all people are intelligent. Dumb psychopaths (it hurts just to say that) can probably see most of what a smart one could. I would say not all, though. With that, we can agree.

With regards to seeing things others can't: Tell me, what can a psychopath see that no one else can? It's a simple enough question. Not, what can psychopaths see that most people can't, but what can they see, that without a shadow of a doubt no one else can see if they were trained to look for it through practice, be it months, years, decades, whatever?

There is a difference between Seeing something, and Sensing something. That's the difference that I think you're getting at. We still see things, but it's as if our brain clicks to subconscious cues, victims for example. We just now, in a flash. We can rewind the reel, and try and figure out what we saw, and other people can see it to, but for us, it's basically instantaneous.

I agree that not everyone can see these things, but my point was that most people could be conditioned to. There would be no point, really, but they could. Speaking of which, have you seen Equilibrium? They used children to spot people in crowds who weren't taking their emotion suppressants. I thought it had an interesting correlation.

Zhawq said...

Notable,

"So now that you know how I view the words in this context, do you still disagree?"

I have to say, yes, I still do.

You write:

"Even a simple-minded child has cunning.

Clever: To be sly, cunning, mentally sharp or talented."

A simple-minded child is not mentally sharp! If it was it wouldn't be simple-minded. It may have cunning, but what does cunning mean if not in relation to the surroundings it is used in? And if the surroundings are intelligent, a simple minded cunning doesn't appear cunning but foolish.

The word clever has slightly different meanings according to the situations and qualities it's being used about, but it is never about simple-mindedness. I may be about a child, but that would be a talented and/or intelligent child.


"I'm talking about natural human tendencies and talents"

In a sense all human beings have sociopathic, antisocial and psychopathic tendencies. They also all have social and caring tendencies.
It is meaningless to discuss if not in the context of what is 'common', since that was what you first said:

"Almost all people are clever and cunning."

It must've been a slip of mind, Notable, for surely you can see it makes no sense to say that.
We wouldn't have a society full of sleepwalkers if they were all clever and cunning. They'd see they were being played in a second and make sure to find a way out, somehow, if only partially (which is what most 'clever and cunning' people do).

"...much like most animals have to some degree. It's not learned, it's instinctual."

That we can agree on, of course. All tendencies are likely linked to some form of instinct.

To be cunning and clever must be partially learned because it takes place in cultural contexts.
If you have talent and personal inclination, you will learn how to realize your talent. If you don't, it will never come to expression.


"In regards to focus, how are you defining intelligence here?"

I see focus to be a fundamental part of intelligence. Without focus you cannot direct or use your intellect and it will never get to develop, which is also included in the meaning of Intelligence, since it has to do with understanding, learning, deducing, concluding, predicting and applying.

A higher cognitive ability is a definition of a certain aspect of intelligence.

"Dumb psychopaths (it hurts just to say that) can probably see most of what a smart one could."

I've met a few intellectually not very intelligent psychopaths. I'll say they could see some of the things I see, and which most people do not see, but they couldn't see most of the things I can see which have allowed me to lead a more interesting life than they ever would (and they're most likely dead now, most of them anyway).


"Tell me, what can a psychopath see that no one else can?"

The answer to what you say in this section is impossible to answer with a few words. We're talking about a different reality in a way. It is a neuro(-psycho)logical difference and therefore in it's foundation a cognitive difference.

I am exploring - and sharing - this very question in my blog. It is not so much a question about 'what' as it is about 'how'. But since the two things are connected, the result is complex and not one-sided.

I'm not sure a non-psychopath can be trained and coached into seeing things like a psychopath sees them. They may be able to see something that amounts to much of the same, but they'll necessarily have to mentally process the experience differently. And even though there are measurements that can be made with different formulae, we also know that the end product consists of more than the sum.
A quest is more than it's goal, it is also the journey, and the one experiencing the two will see the end result, the same piece of reality that others see, differently from them.

Zhawq said...

continued...

"There is a difference between Seeing something, and Sensing something."

Yes. When I talk about 'intelligent psychopaths see things others do not', I mean seeing as in opposed to merely sensing something.

In fact, some normal people sense some of the things a psychopath sees, but it remains a vague and passing sense, and psychopaths (especially intelligent onces) are good at diverting attention.


"We can rewind the reel, and try and figure out what we saw, and

"other people can see it to, but for us, it's basically instantaneous."

That too, yes.

There's a broad group of people who are neither completely 'empathic normal' nor 'psychopaths', but who have some tending traits that allow them to be able to understand what a psychopath sees.

leading prominent researchers in the field are such people.

On a later article I'll bring an example which will blow the minds of many both normal and sociopathic, antisocial people - and maybe a psychopath or two.

I'd have published it already, but I've displayed some of the resource material that I need to create links to for the article to work, but I hope I'll get it in order soon - hopefully within the coming week.


"Speaking of which, have you seen Equilibrium?"

Wow, what you mention about this movie (it's a movie, yes?) sounds intriguing. I just gotta see it!! Hope I can find a cheap copy on Amazon.

Thanks for bringing it to my attention. :)

Zhawq said...

continued...

"There is a difference between Seeing something, and Sensing something."

Yes. When I talk about 'intelligent psychopaths see things others do not', I mean seeing as in opposed to merely sensing something.

In fact, some normal people sense some of the things a psychopath sees, but it remains a vague and passing sense, and psychopaths (especially intelligent onces) are good at diverting attention.


"We can rewind the reel, and try and figure out what we saw, and

"other people can see it to, but for us, it's basically instantaneous."

That too, yes.

There's a broad group of people who are neither completely 'empathic normal' nor 'psychopaths', but who have some tending traits that allow them to be able to understand what a psychopath sees.

leading prominent researchers in the field are such people.

On a later article I'll bring an example which will blow the minds of many both normal and sociopathic, antisocial people - and maybe a psychopath or two.

I'd have published it already, but I've displayed some of the resource material that I need to create links to for the article to work, but I hope I'll get it in order soon - hopefully within the coming week.


"Speaking of which, have you seen Equilibrium?"

Wow, what you mention about this movie (it's a movie, yes?) sounds intriguing. I just gotta see it!! Hope I can find a cheap copy on Amazon.

Thanks for bringing it to my attention. :)

Zhawq said...

Notable:

" You'd have to be viewed as weak or foolish not to pull it off, or so drastically polar opposite of that person's view on something."

Not even so. You can turn someone completely around they'll take a stand that is destructive towards themselves. That's the very point.


"Almost all people are clever and cunning."

I guess we see things very differently in this matter.


"I don't think intelligence has much to do with seeing clearly. I think what it is would have to be Focus."

Again, I have to disagree. Clearly focus is needed, but so is intelligence. A retarded individual doesn't see anything clearly. Yeah, maybe food on the plate when they're hungry, but ask them to tell you what they deciphered from this morning's news feed and they can focus as much as they like, they won't be able to.


"It doesn't make me capable of seeing something others don't through observation"

In that case it's not what you say it is. If it was, you'd see something others don't ... through observation.


"Anyone can find these "gems" that psychopaths claim to see that no one else can."

No, anyone cannot. If they could, they would. There's a reason why so many come and say they wish they could see what and how 'we' see.


"The issue being that we are looking for them from Day 1"

We are looking for them from day 1 because that's how we're 'wired', it's what we were made to do, so to speak. Everybody will tend to follow their inherent 'talent', but only the strongest pull it off and live by it, most become 'redirected' through their upbringing and the pressure from their surroundings.


MrBlake:

"Haha. There you go again nit picking about not being a psychopath or maybe being one."

So I do. I'm a fine, empathic individual if you don't realize. Haven't you noticed my tendency to shed a tear whenever someone mentions a love story or their neighbor had a baby?

Oh, nobody mentioned any of those things, that's right. Maybe that's why I come off as such a cold hearted bastard. Man, it's not fair, I'm SO misunderstood! Hehe


"Don't get me wrong, I know why you do it, and sure only others on the spectrum can really spot you."

Uhm... I somehow think there may be quite a few around these parts who think I'm a psychopath or a sociopath or whatever even if they're not.
It's just a feeling I have. But maybe I'm paranoid, lol.


"And you know I like you, pal! ;)"

I like you too, Blake.

TheNotablePath said...

Confidence is Never Wrong.

That about sums it up. You'd have to be viewed as weak or foolish not to pull it off, or so drastically polar opposite of that person's view on something.

On seeing clearly. Almost all people are clever and cunning. It's in our blood, as a natural hybrid omnivore. Even complete dolts can figure things out. I don't think intelligence has much to do with seeing clearly. I think what it is would have to be Focus.

As someone of the spectrum, I can attest I have intense focus. Tunnel vision, if anything, but with eagle eye lenses. It doesn't make me capable of seeing something others don't through observation, but it means that I will see it more often, because that is what I'm looking for, as an intra-species predator.

Anyone can find these "gems" that psychopaths claim to see that no one else can. The issue being that we are looking for them from Day 1, where most stop in early childhood as empathy and strong emotions take hold. We never stop being vigilant, so it's fair to say that your average Joe could catch up, but probably wouldn't have much of a chance until his/her hormones calmed the eff down.